Oh, and, any chance you could change the Arbiter's heal so it gets less health from infantry and the health restored from each kill increases with each harder enemy killed? Well, consider, not change. :P

MangyForestCat:

Circle, we're getting almost everything we asked for looked into in this patch baby! Cutter is being buffed FINALLY! Hopefully they'll play around with his unit costs.

Thank you Robot for listening to the fans. Here are a few more suggestions for Cutter. I am personally championing the cause of Cutter since he is the leader that everyone agrees probably needs the most work.

Cutter

• Elephants cost should be reduced to 300 resources.
• If you make the Elephant stronger, as you have already noted that Robot is looking into, and make it cost less by reducing it to 300 resources then I ask nothing else be done with Cutter because I feel that everything necessary has been done for him. I feel that those two changes alone are enough to balance Cutter.
• Reduce the costs of Marines and Flamethrowers by 25%. (75 resources each)

OR alternatively

• Reduce the costs of all infantry by 10%
• Marines - 90
• Flamethrowers - 90
• Spartans - 270

Those are my suggestions and thank you Robot again for listening to the fans.

 

I hope my post didnt come off as saracastic.  I truely ment what i said

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iEchoic - 1v1 Gamebattles Acct.:

GG (Prince), you have a better anders mirror than me. I'm picking up a new leader.

Pw~ J4883d 1~ t3h f4c3!!one1!1

Adamzzz:Oh, and, any chance you could change the Arbiter's heal so it gets less health from infantry and the health restored from each kill increases with each harder enemy killed? Well, consider, not change. :P

 

More health from bigger units? Already done! You should kill a Scarab with the Arbiter, his health will go from nothing to almost completely full! 

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Im Allhere:

Nocbl2:

"Oh, hey, that saggy old cripple is too fast. Lets screw him over in a month."

his chair ran low on batteries from zooming around all day long.

The early game buffs to Cutter/Infantry sound great...I've been playing cutter and going Scorps early game because the infantry just are not viable until ODST.

I like the gauss v. armour nerf, and hogs do strike me as building far to fast, although that might not be so much of a problem once Anders is knocked down a peg, and I agree that reducing the build speed of hogs has the potential to make the covenant and their special infantry units far too powerful early game.

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______________________________________________

More Caliber Per Capita

Nevermind that, I read it as 'constructing', not 'constructed'.

@Supermeep: Fair enough. He still gets a huge amount from killing un-upgraded Flamers, which I find pretty annoying. 

Timotron:

Balance changes:: 

1.  Gauss warthog gauss cannon damage bonus against units with heavy armor (Scorpions, Wraiths, Scarabs, Locusts) reduced so that tanks will stay as a viable option to counter warthogs.

This is definately the fix I was looking for. However, if this doesn't include the Hunter's Shield something needs to be done about that because none of the fixes below balance out the Hunter/Hog fight.

2.  Warthog build time slightly increased to restrict how fast players can mass and replace warthogs during the game.

 I don't think there is a need to do this. Any adjustment in time will only affect early game, where Hogs are not OP and are essential to survival. Pumping from multiple bases with Reserves will still be viable. This change will do more harm than good, especially since you are aiming to fix the Hog with the first balance change.

3.  Anders bonus to tech build rate reduced to further balance the leader.

Don't listen to the people that don't know what they are talking about. Anders is not OP, she can just exploit the OP of Gauss which you are fixing. If you nerf her speed in researching Techs, where's her advantage? Saving money on researching Techs is nothing compared to Forge's.

4.  Base turrets attack and health boosted slightly to increase turret viability in early and late game.

I believe a defender should be able to defend himself better than they currently can. This is a great addition. 

5.  Elephant health increased to improve survivability and viability as a unit.

Also a great addition, however I would like to see them Pelicanable since Cutter seems to be receiving no buff.

6.  Grenade/ Plasma grenade / RPG damage against medium armor (warthogs, ghosts, choppers, wolverines and cobras) increased to both better balance marines/ grunts against warthogs and to improve marines overall against players who try to turtle with wolverines and cobras.

Grenades and rockets already do a ton of damage. Plus they get to throw their Grenades again when they miss. This seems to be an addition to quieten the people moaning about Marines, but it won't fix the fact that fast units can still outmicro them. You'll never make the Infantry lovers happy, so I don't see why you should waste your time trying.

7.  Recycle basic cost return fixed to be 50% for constructed buildings.  (While a technically a bug, this directly impacts many slightly exploitive strategies)

I heard somewhere this was intended from the beginning. I think it's a shame, but it will stop the Brute Temple delete and the double base Gauss spam.

I just hope that Anders doesn't get hit and that Gauss is repaired. I think the turret increase is a major one, which should hopefully stop the bad rushers from getting cheap wins.

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zIP r i n c eIz

MeatShield:

everyone knows prince is the best

MangyForestCat:

Circle, we're getting almost everything we asked for looked into in this patch baby! Cutter is being buffed FINALLY! Hopefully they'll play around with his unit costs.

Thank you Robot for listening to the fans. Here are a few more suggestions for Cutter. I am personally championing the cause of Cutter since he is the leader that everyone agrees probably needs the most work.

Cutter

• Elephants cost should be reduced to 300 resources.
• If you make the Elephant stronger, as you have already noted that Robot is looking into, and make it cost less by reducing it to 300 resources then I ask nothing else be done with Cutter because I feel that everything necessary has been done for him. I feel that those two changes alone are enough to balance Cutter.
• Reduce the costs of Marines and Flamethrowers by 25%. (75 resources each)

OR alternatively

• Reduce the costs of all infantry by 10%
• Marines - 90
• Flamethrowers - 90
• Spartans - 270

Those are my suggestions and thank you Robot again for listening to the fans.

I like the cut of this idea's jib.  It seemed to me that cutter is benefited to an infantry centric tactic, but only in part.  driven to it by the use of elephants.  however the elephant rushes are for the most part unsustainable from a supply standpoint.  not to mention the idea of reducing infantry upgrade research costs or time, however i would relish a fix that didn't step on Ander's toes. 

Timotron:

Elecbound:

The grenade thing is interesting...now my expendable idiots...erm...well trained men can fight off more units! Hooray! Wait...what about gremlins? Do I still need 5 marines to kill 1?

 

Good catch, the infantry grenade boost to medium armor targets includes the Gremlin as well so marines will indeed get a boost against Gremlins.

 

This proves my point. Gremlins already take a lot of damage from infantry. You're trying to repair a problem that isn't there. The reason infantry don't rape a clever Anders is because Gremlins are faster than Marines and can retreat. You're just allowing for a large margin of lcuk for infantry users, which is a ridiculous thing to want.

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zIP r i n c eIz

MeatShield:

everyone knows prince is the best

MoCalibPrCapita:

The early game buffs to Cutter/Infantry sound great...I've been playing cutter and going Scorps early game because the infantry just are not viable until ODST.

I like the gauss v. armour nerf, and hogs do strike me as building far to fast, although that might not be so much of a problem once Anders is knocked down a peg, and I agree that reducing the build speed of hogs has the potential to make the covenant and their special infantry units far too powerful early game.

 

Well, non-AnderSpam hogs already fall to hunters (as they are supposed to), no change there. And if you scout, you will know to build air units/anti-infantry. 

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Im Allhere:

Nocbl2:

"Oh, hey, that saggy old cripple is too fast. Lets screw him over in a month."

his chair ran low on batteries from zooming around all day long.

First, I'd like to say thanks for involving the community in the new changes, as this is certainly a new and appreciated method.

 

I'm mostly satisfied with the current proposed changes.

#7 is a change I'm quite dubious about, as I doubt there are a lot of "exploitive" strategies involving them.  I think Ander's hog rush involving the self destruction of a reactor is one, but fixes on the warthogs themselves should change that.  Some leader rushes involve destroying the Temple.  However, I question whether these are "exploitive" strategies and not simply legitimate strategies.  The more basic strategy in the strategy guide involves teching up a unit to Grizzlies and destroying your reactor for extra supplies since you'll only need Tech 2 to produce the tanks.

As for the infantry damage boost to medium armor, I'm satisfied with that as well.  However, would it hurt too much to boost their damage against air units as well?  As it is right now, I don't think I'm all that off in saying that main infantry are NOT a reliable soft counter to air.  I realize 100% that there are hard counters, however I don't think anyone ever got slapped on the head for using tanks against main infantry, or air against tanks.  It is only when using main infantry against air that my intelligence(and sanity) comes into question by other players.

At the very least, basic RPS is now getting closer to being the way it's supposed to be(as advertised anyways), just one little step should make it perfect.

Of course, there IS the tiny little detail with Grizzlies destroying their hard counters and with the Arbiter still being a one-man army, but maybe we can leave those for the next TU, as I don't have any suggestions on how to fix those yet. 

Do we get points if they self destruct  while being attacked kind sir?

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58/58 Achievements!

Aloysius:The choice was between upgrading a turret or letting you aim it. We went with upgrading a turret.

Wow, aiming the turrets would be a much better addition. Albeit, probably harder for you guys. I'm just thinking the being able to aim a turret would reward good micro. Stronger turrets would reward building the turret...

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zIP r i n c eIz

MeatShield:

everyone knows prince is the best